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Isabeau's Journal

 November, 12 2005

OK, folks-this is the general forum now for questions that don't seem to fit in any of the other threads. I'm going to sort some of the earlier posts into the appropriate forums, but it might take a while, so bear with me. I'll delete the ones that have already been reposted by their authors.

I was reading HOME the other day and the quote which described Celeborn's sailing to Valinor :
"with him went the last living memory of the Elder Days in Middle-earth." (FotR, p. 25)

This passage is, as so many are in Tolkien, ambiguous. This is what the Tolkien wiki says in the entry "Elder days":

"During the Second and Third Age, the term referred to the First Age and before, but in the Fourth Age the term began to be applied to all three ages which came before: a time before the dominance of Men and the dwindling of the Elves and other races."

So either you count Celeborn as the only (known) Elf left from the Elder days (apart from Círdan, I might add); or you can count the twins, too.

Somewhere it says that they were allowed to delay their choice beyond Elrond's departure for a time (IIRC, somewhere in Letters), and as there is no definite time limit given, who knows their final decision? They could have gone with Celeborn, or they could have gone some time before him.

I know it can be argued both ways, that the twins did go with Celeborn - but what was stopping the twins from sailing with their father?

I personally believe that they stayed for Arwen's sake, and once she died, they left with their grandfather. And that Elrond was glad about this decision, which left Arwen not totally without her own kin who could understand her in ways even Aragorn wouldn't always be able to.

I understand if I was Elrond I would be desperate to secure the fact that my children would come back to me, all I can feel is an immense sadness for Elrond, as he loved the people in his life so much in that he was able to let them go and fufil their own wants and destinies.

Waaaah! Yes, "as kind as summer", isn't he? And he had to think about Celebrían, too: whether their children's absence would somehow effect her health negatively, when she doesn't know what all has happened since she left M-e - Gondor and the Ring War and Aragorn etc. She can't talk with Arwen and see for herself that Arwen chose what was best for her, freely and deliberately.

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