Princes of Dol Amroth

By:Isabeau
 February, 25 2006

Questions about the life and times of Imrahil and his family can be asked here, including questions about Ultimatums, Kin-Strife and the shorter stories. Discussions about Brand can go either here or in the Best-Loved Son thread, since his stories sort of overlap both cycles.

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 [71] Imrahil also shows in Ultimatums that he has no problem asking for her assistance and/or advice (when he's sitting in judgement on court cases, as well as in Pelargir). Thus, with him she does have some outlet for her intellect too. Being an at-need researcher and a sounding board for her husband is not exactly the same as being asked to sit on a ruling council, of course, but probably the closest thing possible for a woman in Gondor

Yes, I think that's very true. Also, as was mentioned earlier in this thread, Nimrien is one of the few women of Imrahil's class and acquaintance who knows him -- really knows him -- and is not afraid to take him to task or call a spade a spade with him. To someone like Imrahil, who is very self-confident and strong and witty but also has a conscious and cares about how he affects other people, that kind of relationship would be invaluable. He doesn't need someone who is in awe of him, he needs someone who truly knows him. That's what will allow him to stay sane and focused and rule well. I think once she realizes that, Nimrien will see that in supporting Imrahil she is supporting her country.

Rebecca
Posted:Mar 14, 2006 19:53 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [72] Isabeau, this is absurdly obscure, but it's one of those things that's stuck firmly in my mind and I can't seem to find the answer myself. In the start of Ch. 10 Kin-Strife, teenage Imrahil references a "young Lord Husayn" when talking about Haradrim court stuff. Husayn's name seemed so familiar that I was sure he'd shown up prominently in another story of yours, but I can't find him anywhere obvious. Am I imagining things?

Also, later in the chapter, Imrahil references starting his Swan Knight training upon his return to Dol Amroth. I think he is 16 at this point. But K-S starts when he and Andrahar are 19? And it seems like both of them still have a year of training left when Imrahil gets sent off to sea. So, since Heth's training is set to be only two years long, does the length of training vary by how young/experienced an esquire is when starting the program? It would make sense - I could especially see a 16-year-old needing more time to reach his full strength and get some extra maturity for the high level of performance expected of Swan Knights.

Denise
Posted:Mar 17, 2006 18:16 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [73] Denise wrote: Isabeau, this is absurdly obscure, but it's one of those things that's stuck firmly in my mind and I can't seem to find the answer myself. In the start of Ch. 10 Kin-Strife, teenage Imrahil references a "young Lord Husayn" when talking about Haradrim court stuff. Husayn's name seemed so familiar that I was sure he'd shown up prominently in another story of yours, but I can't find him anywhere obvious. Am I imagining things?

Yup. Haven't used him anywhere else. Though it's a perfectly good name...

Also, later in the chapter, Imrahil references starting his Swan Knight training upon his return to Dol Amroth. I think he is 16 at this point. But K-S starts when he and Andrahar are 19? And it seems like both of them still have a year of training left when Imrahil gets sent off to sea. So, since Heth's training is set to be only two years long, does the length of training vary by how young/experienced an esquire is when starting the program? It would make sense - I could especially see a 16-year-old needing more time to reach his full strength and get some extra maturity for the high level of performance expected of Swan Knights.

It is indeed variable, depending upon the individual. Aragorn wanted her to spend two years at Dol Amroth, but whether that would actually be enough for her to complete her training would be up to the senior Swan Knights. Older, blooded soldiers like Heth with her level of experience don't have quite as much ground to cover, though the courtly side of things will be the hold-up for her. A lot depends upon how hard she works as to how long things will take.

I think Imrahil might also have had a bit of a sea tour in there somewhere-his father says that he is to take up sea training again when he punishes him for the business with the players.

Isabeau
Posted:Mar 17, 2006 18:30 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [74] Also Andra didn't start training straiaght away did he? or do you go with a different version to pawns and Symbols, the epiloge on that always makes me cry.

One last question, Why do the Swan Knights stay at the hotle in Pelagir rather than the kings house?

Nargil
Posted:Mar 19, 2006 14:55 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [75] Because Brand wouldn't be working at the kings house, Duh!

Are Andrahar and Peloren actually friends or do they just tolerate each other, and do we get to see them meet up again after Pelorens year in the army?

*Star*
Posted:Mar 19, 2006 14:57 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [76] When do Imrahil and Andra get official notice of Boromir's death? In Well Favored, Imrahil says something about the news coming a couple of days ago, and I'm assuming the armies are about a day from the city at that point. Or he just referencing his dream, and noone else finds out until after they get to Minas Tirith? I'm wondering when Andra finds out, mostly - and when does Imrahil tell him about the dream? Trying to fit it into Andrahar's mood and responses in On Far Fields and Last Rites. You would think that it would give him hope, but then Andra doesn't put much faith in things as insubstantial as dreams, so...

Denise
Posted:Mar 20, 2006 15:01 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [77] Star asked: Are Andrahar and Peloren actually friends or do they just tolerate each other, and do we get to see them meet up again after Pelorens year in the army?

They eventually become friends, certainly not as close as Andra is to the royal family, but they have a relationship based on mutual respect and shared responsibilities.

Haven't decided yet how much you'll see of Peloren in the intervening years.

Isabeau
Posted:Mar 21, 2006 18:47 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [78] Nargil wrote: Also Andra didn't start training straiaght away did he? or do you go with a different version to pawns and Symbols, the epiloge on that always makes me cry.

I sometimes go with a slightly different version than what Soledad writes, though I'm certainly guilty of using many of her excellent ideas regarding Gildor and Edhellond, and Tirathiel.

One last question, Why do the Swan Knights stay at the hotle in Pelagir rather than the kings house?

Imrahil could probably ask permission to use the King's House, it's certainly big enough, and he would if it were truly an emergency, but the short answer is that he doesn't want to owe Denethor a favor.

Isabeau
Posted:Mar 21, 2006 18:52 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [79] Isn't Denethor dead at this point, the swan knights are on thier way home after the war?

Likeing the new chapter of kin-strife BTW.

Nargil
Posted:Mar 22, 2006 10:23 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [80] Isn't Denethor dead at this point, the swan knights are on thier way home after the war?

Could it have something to do with the fighting that took place in Pelargir, when Aragorn took over the Corsair fleet? It was months ago, but the King's House could very well have been a major target... Which reminds me: I don't remember Tolkien ever saying anything about the disposition of the Gondor/Dol Amroth fleet during the Ring War. Do you and Altariel have thoughts about where Erchirion and the other captains were during that time?

Very much enjoyed the latest foray inside Imrahil's head in the K-S update!

Denise
Posted:Mar 22, 2006 18:38 GMT  Reply to this Comment
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