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Isabeau's Journal
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Isabeau's Journal

By:Isabeau
 November, 12 2005

OK, folks-this is the general forum now for questions that don't seem to fit in any of the other threads. I'm going to sort some of the earlier posts into the appropriate forums, but it might take a while, so bear with me. I'll delete the ones that have already been reposted by their authors.


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448 replies


 [201] Somthing just struck me, Aragorn used to be commander of the Northern rangers with Halbarad as his second, now Aragorn is king and Halbarad is dead, maybe thats why he want's heth trained at Dol-Amroth, she knows how to be a ranger but needs command and mounted weopens skills then she could take over.

Nargil
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 09:53 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [202] Somthing just struck me, Aragorn used to be commander of the Northern rangers with Halbarad as his second, now Aragorn is king and Halbarad is dead, maybe thats why he want's heth trained at Dol-Amroth, she knows how to be a ranger but needs command and mounted weopens skills then she could take over.

That's an interesting possibility. And if that were the case I could imagine that Aragorn wouldn't necessarily announce his intentions to anyone right off the bat; given that he'd already really interfered with Hethlin's preferences vis a vis Ithilien vs. Dol Amroth; also given that Hethlin's interest in going north might be influenced by whether or not she is comfortable with her northern kin, and last of all given that he wouldn't want to be instrumental in putting her in Elrohir's path, at least not while Elrond is still in Middle Earth. Regardless of whether or not Elrond holds Aragorn responsible for the loss of Arwen, Aragorn clearly feels guilty on that front. I'm hoping that Aragorn's guilt is a function of the pain he feels about Elrond's pain, and not because blame has been assigned him by his foster father. If Elrond is holding Aragorn responsible then he's really not as wise as I always thought he was.

Rebecca
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 10:04 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [203] February 2, 2003

Hi Isabeau!

I have another Eagles question, somewhat related to the Litharel rant I indulged in yesterday. Did the Eagles know about Halaran's death prior to the Ring War? Did they know that Halaran had children? If so, would they have communicated any of that information to any of the Dunedain?

I got the sense that Halaran continued to work with the Eagles sometimes even after moving south, as I think Celeborn mentioned seeing him once while he was on an errand for the Eagles just prior to Hethlin's birth. If they did continue to keep in touch at least periodically in the years before the Ring War, I'm guessing that the Eagles must have at least noted that Halaran's homestead was destroyed and no one was around. I could see them reasonably concluding that the entire family had been killed. Perhaps, given the rift between Halaran and his in-laws, the Eagles didn't feel obliged to convey that information to Litharel?

Thanks!

Rebecca
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 10:18 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [204] Nargil said: Somthing just struck me, Aragorn used to be commander of the Northern rangers with Halbarad as his second, now Aragorn is king and Halbarad is dead, maybe thats why he want's heth trained at Dol-Amroth, she knows how to be a ranger but needs command and mounted weopens skills then she could take over.

That's something that IMO won't happen for at least a long time. Don't forget that Hethlin has no knowledge whatsoever about the North, and I don't think Aragorn would want to put her in front of any capable people he already had there, her grandfather being just one example. I do think that despite all their secrecy, that the Northern Dúnedain had an intact social and command structure in place, and IMO it would not be very effective to disrupt that with someone from the outside. Furthermore, I don't think that this is in Aragorn's plans for Hethlin, at least for the forseeable future (don't forget his plans for her as Arwen's secret bodyguard - you won't want your bodyguard to be known in such a public position). And I don't think that he can already include her in any long-term planning of that sort, he doesn't know her and her eventual development well enough for that.

If working in the North, I see her more as some kind of freelancer, not necessarily firmly integrated in a system.
However, once all Heth's training is complete and after, say, some decades, getting to know the North, maybe rising up in the ranks, why not?

Imhiriel
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 12:37 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [205] I'm interested in knowing more about Halaran's continued (or not) relationship with the Eagles, too. Heth seems completely clueless about her family's connection with them, as all her interaction in CMC is based on some sort of deep instinct. And the Windlord had apparently not heard of Heth's family being killed when they first meet in CMC Ch.10. (So Litharel would not have heard of it from the Eagles, though still no excuse for him!) If Halaran did keep in contact over the years he must have kept it secret, and had not done it in the years before he died. Why wouldn't he have told Hethlin about the bond with the Eagles, though? Even if she hadn't inherited it, or if it was dormant and somehow only manifested itself in the heir (her little brother becoming heir when he was born, say), she would still learn of it eventually, wouldn't she? It didn't seem to be a secret among the Dunadain, for example.

Denise
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 15:53 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [206] That's something that IMO won't happen for at least a long time. Don't forget that Hethlin has no knowledge whatsoever about the North, and I don't think Aragorn would want to put her in front of any capable people he already had there, her grandfather being just one example.

If working in the North, I see her more as some kind of freelancer, not necessarily firmly integrated in a system.
However, once all Heth's training is complete and after, say, some decades, getting to know the North, maybe rising up in the ranks, why not?


I concur.

Rebecca
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 19:43 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [207] If Halaran did keep in contact over the years he must have kept it secret, and had not done it in the years before he died. Why wouldn't he have told Hethlin about the bond with the Eagles, though? Even if she hadn't inherited it, or if it was dormant and somehow only manifested itself in the heir (her little brother becoming heir when he was born, say), she would still learn of it eventually, wouldn't she? It didn't seem to be a secret among the Dunadain, for example.

Well, in "Cage No Bird" he does start to hint at a special relationship with birds of prey. But it is a mystery as to why he didn't just come out and tell Hethlin about the Eagles and their connection to Hethlin's family. I guess I assumed that he withheld the specifics because he feared he would have then had to explain why he and Hethlin's mother left the North, given that they had such strong ties there. I assumed that if Halaran did keep in touch with the Eagles after moving to Anorien, it was sporadic at best, and he was waiting to tell Hethlin until he felt she was old enough to understand about the curse and about people's prejudice against him (and by extension her) because of that curse. I imagine it was a real sore spot for both of Hethlin's parents, especially if Litharel and the rest of Hethlin's mother's family did not keep in touch and had not been at all supportive when they'd been struggling with gossip and spitefulness among the Dunedain. Perhaps Halaran felt he couldn't even broach the subject until Hethlin was mature enough to take the information on board without requiring him to censor his bitterness for her sake. Because in his shoes I'd be really offended, and at the same time feel really guilty about what his wife has had to suffer as a result of his ancestor's treachery. I bet it wasn't easy for him to talk about -- better to be an anonymous homesteader in Anorien. Or, at least, simpler.

Rebecca
Posted:Feb 2, 2006 19:53 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [208] Hi, everyone. Sorry to be so quiet but I've been busy the last couple of days and will be over the weekend-our local SCA group is having their big annual event tomorrow. But I am reading and will try to be back in commenting mode by Monday at the latest.

Isabeau



Posted:Feb 3, 2006 23:57 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [209] Have a good weekend, Isabeau! As you can see, we seem quite able to entertain ourselves when you are busy. :)

Denise
Posted:Feb 4, 2006 03:30 GMT  Reply to this Comment


 [210] -our local SCA group is having their big annual event tomorrow

Oh what fun! I take it SCA is Society for Creative Anachronism? Those folks put so much effort into their activities, it looks like. If you're involved with that I'm amazed that you can work, have a family and still find time to write! Wow!

Rebecca
Posted:Feb 4, 2006 09:38 GMT  Reply to this Comment
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